More than I realized. As a kid, my favorite of the original trilogy was ROTJ. It had everything - an opening where the heroes got vengeance on a big slug, there was a dramatic-looking Death Star, speeder bikes, and force lightning.
My father told me (years later), how much some folks hated it for some of the same things. Rehashing the Death Star, Han accidentally killing Boba Fett (this hyped up bounty hunter that in the previous movie was clever and even mouthed off to Vader himself), Ewoks being cuddly teddy bears with janky traps, Leia being yet another Skywalker out of nowhere…basically, a lot of the same goofy shit people railed on George for in the prequels (myself included: since these conversations with my dad came up because I was a teenager complaining about Jar Jar, Yoda ping ponging around, etc.).
Later I saw that plenty of folks complained about ESB being moodier, the “No, I am your father” being a twist out of nowhere and dramatically undermining Obi-Wan’s character by his being dishonest. Some of the same “canon-breaking” retcons that we all complain about today.
Granted…I still love ROTJ despite its flaws, and while I never enjoyed the prequels as much as a lot of folks, I find them endearing in an odd kind of way. The Sequel Trilogy less so, but there’s a few bright spots.
Basically, I wonder what the reception of the movies would have been if we had the internet then, and especially if we had engagement-based algorithms driving things, which does such a great job of amplifying hate.
Yeah RotJ was Lucas made Star Wars into a franchise devoted to toy sales. Bringing in other writers and directors to take over was the smart move, it’s what he did for ESB and it resulted in a great movie. But because of his petty spat with the Director’s Guild, he decided to get a non-union directo for RotJ but basically directed it himself.
Then he announced the Prequel Trilogy on the day he got a good toy deal with Hasbro.
I feel like George Lucas felt like he compromised with the studios too much on the first one, didn’t think it would be a success. But it ended up being the most successful movie ever, and he didn’t understand why. So he didn’t really give a shit about it and just used it to make money, and didn’t make any real effort on the movies after the first one.
No movie ruined the themes of Star Wars as much as ESB. Every important person being a Skywalker or a Palpatine turns Luke into plot royalty, and takes away his specialness as an everyman hero.
Luke’s father in 4 wasn’t important to the plot. He wasn’t even named. If a character in a movie doesn’t get a name, they’re not important. Luke’s father had the kind of abstract importance that matters to characters but not to the audience.
I think you’re not all the familiar with the movie. The Light Saber Obi Wan gives Luke is stated to be his father’s. Obi Wan talks about Luke’s father. Luke mentions wanting to be like his Father in a pivotal moment.
In movies you don’t devote a scene to discussing a character’s father and you don’t mention the character’s father in a pivotal scene if the character’s father isn’t important. It’s also mentioned that Luke’s father was a great pilot and later we see Luke piloting a fighter.
Star Wars is a long cycle of really really really cool concepts and really really really shit execution of putting those concepts on screen. People have disliked pretty much every iteration of SW for some reason or another, and it’s usually defensible. Boils down to suspension of disbelief and ‘to each their own’
I grew up kinda between the originals and prequels, and often found the originals were paced too slow and the whole ewok thing stood out as stupid as fuck even to my 8-ish year old brain; but there was more to like than dislike, so I was fan overall.
Then the prequels come out. Jar Jar used to be what killed it for me, but then the ‘darth’ Jar Jar fan theory came out, and if you watch his character through that lens it’s not quite as bad. I’m 100% sold on that being the original intent with Jar Jar, but then they backed off after so many people fucking hated him in Ep1, and just left him alone as a bumbling idiot and nothing more.
Then the sequels came out and the writing was absolute shit. SW followed that trend for a while, kinda felt like the franchise was dead in the water, existing only as a cash grab… until Rogue One came out, and then Andor, which are both fucking masterpieces.
It used to be movies were movies and not treated like political causes. So saying something like “I though the Leia and Han scenes in the early parts of ESB were a little awkward” (my actual opinion) didn’t mean you were choosing to take a side against people that like ESB. I actually love ESB, but yeah there were some scenes are a bit awkward, and that’s fine, because it’s an action adventure move, so who cares?
So there was a distinction between criticizing parts of a movie and hating a movie. But now in the social media age, everything is either the best thing ever or the worst thing ever, and you group up with people with the same opinion as you.
Star Wars being a hugely popular thing attracts all kinds of algorithm brained people so there’s endless content about whatever thing being the best/worst thing ever about everything in Star Wars.
But in the end they’re just action adventure movies some are really good, some are terrible, and most of it is in between.
Hate might be too strong of a word but I remember how 12-year-old-me found them hard to watch because their special effects looked dated in comparison to the prequels’.
There’s quite a lot of reviews and comments from the time hating ESB (a muppet as a spiritual guide? Contrived twist!) and RotJ (too cheesy! Just an excuse to sell toys!).
Yoda being a little green weirdo was meant to convey that anyone can be a Jedi. Just don’t tell TLJ fans… they think that’s something that wasn’t a thing in Star Wars before Rian Johnson came up with it from his own brilliant and creative mind.
Who ever hated the original films?
More than I realized. As a kid, my favorite of the original trilogy was ROTJ. It had everything - an opening where the heroes got vengeance on a big slug, there was a dramatic-looking Death Star, speeder bikes, and force lightning.
My father told me (years later), how much some folks hated it for some of the same things. Rehashing the Death Star, Han accidentally killing Boba Fett (this hyped up bounty hunter that in the previous movie was clever and even mouthed off to Vader himself), Ewoks being cuddly teddy bears with janky traps, Leia being yet another Skywalker out of nowhere…basically, a lot of the same goofy shit people railed on George for in the prequels (myself included: since these conversations with my dad came up because I was a teenager complaining about Jar Jar, Yoda ping ponging around, etc.).
Later I saw that plenty of folks complained about ESB being moodier, the “No, I am your father” being a twist out of nowhere and dramatically undermining Obi-Wan’s character by his being dishonest. Some of the same “canon-breaking” retcons that we all complain about today.
Granted…I still love ROTJ despite its flaws, and while I never enjoyed the prequels as much as a lot of folks, I find them endearing in an odd kind of way. The Sequel Trilogy less so, but there’s a few bright spots.
Basically, I wonder what the reception of the movies would have been if we had the internet then, and especially if we had engagement-based algorithms driving things, which does such a great job of amplifying hate.
Yeah RotJ was Lucas made Star Wars into a franchise devoted to toy sales. Bringing in other writers and directors to take over was the smart move, it’s what he did for ESB and it resulted in a great movie. But because of his petty spat with the Director’s Guild, he decided to get a non-union directo for RotJ but basically directed it himself.
Then he announced the Prequel Trilogy on the day he got a good toy deal with Hasbro.
I feel like George Lucas felt like he compromised with the studios too much on the first one, didn’t think it would be a success. But it ended up being the most successful movie ever, and he didn’t understand why. So he didn’t really give a shit about it and just used it to make money, and didn’t make any real effort on the movies after the first one.
No movie ruined the themes of Star Wars as much as ESB. Every important person being a Skywalker or a Palpatine turns Luke into plot royalty, and takes away his specialness as an everyman hero.
“I want to learn the ways of the force and become a Jedi like my father”
It was established in the first one that Luke’s father was a powerful Jedi. I guess you didn’t pay attention.
And yeah all of those important characters like Obi Wan Skywalker, Yoda Skywalker, Han Palpatine, Finn Palpatine, Poe Skywalker, LOL.
Luke’s father in 4 wasn’t important to the plot. He wasn’t even named. If a character in a movie doesn’t get a name, they’re not important. Luke’s father had the kind of abstract importance that matters to characters but not to the audience.
I think you’re not all the familiar with the movie. The Light Saber Obi Wan gives Luke is stated to be his father’s. Obi Wan talks about Luke’s father. Luke mentions wanting to be like his Father in a pivotal moment.
In movies you don’t devote a scene to discussing a character’s father and you don’t mention the character’s father in a pivotal scene if the character’s father isn’t important. It’s also mentioned that Luke’s father was a great pilot and later we see Luke piloting a fighter.
Greedo gets more plot value than Luke’s father. He actually gets named.
The amount of slop disney puts out and the fans peddle and push into every damn game and internet space is making me slowly dislike them too.
Star wars is inescapable and it is exhausting.
“Jaws was never my scene and i don’t like star wars”
~ Freddie Mercury
Freddie was more of a Flash Gordon guy.
Damn, what a soundtrack!
Well yeah, he’ll save everyone of us!
BOOOWWWW BA BOWWW BOOWW
Flash!
Ahhh-ah-AH!
Star Wars is a long cycle of really really really cool concepts and really really really shit execution of putting those concepts on screen. People have disliked pretty much every iteration of SW for some reason or another, and it’s usually defensible. Boils down to suspension of disbelief and ‘to each their own’
I grew up kinda between the originals and prequels, and often found the originals were paced too slow and the whole ewok thing stood out as stupid as fuck even to my 8-ish year old brain; but there was more to like than dislike, so I was fan overall.
Then the prequels come out. Jar Jar used to be what killed it for me, but then the ‘darth’ Jar Jar fan theory came out, and if you watch his character through that lens it’s not quite as bad. I’m 100% sold on that being the original intent with Jar Jar, but then they backed off after so many people fucking hated him in Ep1, and just left him alone as a bumbling idiot and nothing more.
Then the sequels came out and the writing was absolute shit. SW followed that trend for a while, kinda felt like the franchise was dead in the water, existing only as a cash grab… until Rogue One came out, and then Andor, which are both fucking masterpieces.
It used to be movies were movies and not treated like political causes. So saying something like “I though the Leia and Han scenes in the early parts of ESB were a little awkward” (my actual opinion) didn’t mean you were choosing to take a side against people that like ESB. I actually love ESB, but yeah there were some scenes are a bit awkward, and that’s fine, because it’s an action adventure move, so who cares?
So there was a distinction between criticizing parts of a movie and hating a movie. But now in the social media age, everything is either the best thing ever or the worst thing ever, and you group up with people with the same opinion as you.
Star Wars being a hugely popular thing attracts all kinds of algorithm brained people so there’s endless content about whatever thing being the best/worst thing ever about everything in Star Wars.
But in the end they’re just action adventure movies some are really good, some are terrible, and most of it is in between.
George Lucas is a genius merchandiser and fun-maker, and things like “cohesion” and “plot” are left for everyone else to figure out.
Hate might be too strong of a word but I remember how 12-year-old-me found them hard to watch because their special effects looked dated in comparison to the prequels’.
I personally find the effects from the original trilogy easier to still watch today than the effects in the prequels.
There’s quite a lot of reviews and comments from the time hating ESB (a muppet as a spiritual guide? Contrived twist!) and RotJ (too cheesy! Just an excuse to sell toys!).
I mean RotJ was an excuse to sell toys.
Yoda being a little green weirdo was meant to convey that anyone can be a Jedi. Just don’t tell TLJ fans… they think that’s something that wasn’t a thing in Star Wars before Rian Johnson came up with it from his own brilliant and creative mind.
I do, they are fucking shit
I don’t like them, even though I’ve tried to like them by watching them multiple times.
Having said that, I honestly think rouge one is a solid movie, and ironically that’s the least star wars movie from all the series.
I don’t hate them, but I don’t think they are all that great tbh.