It’s been a long journey, but here we arrive. Welcome home.

  • KNova@links.dartboard.socialEnglish
    49·
    2 years ago

    I think even calling it Lemmy is not the right move. Yeah, Lemmy is the server software running on a bunch of instances. But we also have kbin, and new softwares will pop up and fork and come and go over time. Once we can do some kind of account or community level migration, it won’t matter whether you are on Lemmy or kbin or the next great thing. Everything will be federated so it will inter-op beautifully. If an unfriendly instance admin comes along, we can collectively cut and run with minimal interruption.

    Thats still a way off from where we are now but the hard step was getting to the Fediverse in the first place. So, welcome to the newcomers among us.

        • Borgzilla@lemmy.caEnglish
          1·
          2 years ago

          I still use both. 99% of Usenet is spam, but there still a few active groups (especially under comp.*). The BBS scene on the other hand, is booming. I see new users every week on my favourite board.

            • duncesplayed@lemmy.oneEnglish
              3·
              2 years ago

              Sadly most people CAN’T connect through dial-up, even if both parties have all the equipment. A lot of telcos have redone their entire network in VoIP stuff (with heavy compression) which makes it hard to keep a connection even at 300.

          • cvr@sh.itjust.worksEnglish
            1·
            2 years ago

            How does a current day BBS work? Landline phone connections are a thing of the past here.

            • duncesplayed@lemmy.oneEnglish
              3·
              2 years ago

              telnet or ssh (usually telnet)

              If you’re connecting from a modern computer, you just get a telnet client that does the appropriate code pages/ANSI/zmodem/etc. If you’re connecting from a real vintage computer, you get a little dongle that pretends to be a modem (and often accepts AT commands, including fake phone numbers), but secretly connects to WiFi and relays through a telnet connection.

              Some BBSes do still have landlines, and there’s the occasional ham radio BBS, but 99.999% of it is through IP-based telnet or ssh these days.

    • Melmi@lemmy.blahaj.zoneEnglish
      17·
      2 years ago

      I think the concept of the Fediverse is still really alien to people, even the people who are using it. Everyone is still so used to their centralized platforms, so they still think of the Fediverse in terms of platforms rather than as a whole.

      You still hear people say “Mastodon” to mean the microblogging corner of the Fediverse even if they’re not actually on Mastodon, and now people say “Lemmy” to mean the link aggregation corner of the Fediverse even if not everyone is actually on Lemmy.

      • morrowind@lemmy.mlEnglish
        19·
        2 years ago

        I recently found and like the term “threadiverse” for reddit-like federated software

      • MetalAirship@lemmy.worldEnglish
        61·
        2 years ago

        Maybe this is an unpopular opinion but the word “Fediverse” leaves a sour taste in my mount just because it sounds so much like the stupidity that was “Metaverse” (yes I know they are completely unrelated)

        • blindsight@beehaw.orgEnglish
          1·
          2 years ago

          I agree, but fur slightly different reasons. “Fed” and “verse” are both fairly loaded root words, “Fed” especially. It also sounds a bit arcane/technical/out there.

          “Lemmy” and “Kbin” are both short, cute, and come without any baggage or expectations. It’s a lot easier to create an identity with a term that doesn’t have any existing associations, imho.

          I think it makes a lot of sense for the technology to be called the Fediverse, since it’s descriptive once you understand it, but I think Lemmy and Kbin will have quicker uptake with new users. They’re better brands to advertise.

      • sillypuddy@mander.xyzEnglish
        3·
        2 years ago

        Are you saying there’s other reddit-like/inspired webservices that are part of the fediverse that aren’t Lemmy? What are those?

    • Be Here Now@beehaw.orgEnglish
      13·
      2 years ago

      undefined> calling it Lemmy is not the right move.

      Spankin’ new here, so what do I know, but while the semantics might not be completely accurate, that is not an uncommon occurrence. And Lemmy sounds personal, with a bit of a Motorhead edge to it.

      Maybe we’ll all be called Lemmies web slinging in the Fediverse one day.

      • speedrun@lemmy.oneEnglish
        2·
        2 years ago

        Yup, having a name is a pretty important aspect of growth. And while the fediverse could certainly work, it’s not very intuitive for new users and also covers such a broad range of functionalities that it won’t help people who are specifically looking for a Reddit alternative. Sure ‘lemmy’ is a misnomer, but it’s better to have a name being used incorrectly than no name at all.

  • 🐝🇭🇪🅻🅻🇪🇧🅴🆁🇹🐝@beehaw.orgEnglish
    42·
    2 years ago

    Tried the official Reddit app today and boy people weren’t joking when they say it sucks. I thought it’d just be the usual experience plus some ads but I was totally wrong.

    The official app doesn’t respect your subreddit subscriptions at all, instead force feeding you feeds of whatever their algorithm thinks will drive maximum engagement just like a shit version of Facebook does. The “hot” etc functional is completely stipped from it entirely.

    Guess I’m here to stay on the fediverse now.

    • SharkEatingBreakfast@beehaw.orgEnglish
      23·
      2 years ago

      What absolutely sucks about this is that I had carefully curated my subscriptions on RIF in order not to exacerbate my dumb mental health issues.

      Hell, I’ve read angry posts about people in recovery from addiction and alcohol saying how they keep seeing ads for beer or gambling and things like that.

      It’s horrifying!!

      • remi_pan@sh.itjust.worksEnglish
        4·
        2 years ago

        The algorithm really doesn’t work when you are critical or sceptical over a subject. For instance crypto sceptics from r/buttcoin being shown binance ads. Yes, they do show an interest in crypto, but may be the least suceptible persons to that ad.

        • SharkEatingBreakfast@beehaw.orgEnglish
          2·
          2 years ago

          It’s different with subs focused on addiction & recovery though.

          Maybe it’s a very bad idea to targeted knife ads in a suicide watch sub, you know? Susceptible people and all.

          • remi_pan@sh.itjust.worksEnglish
            1·
            2 years ago

            I completely agree with you, and your example is very good indeed. (Maybe my previous comment was not clear ? English is not my mothertongue)

            • SharkEatingBreakfast@beehaw.orgEnglish
              1·
              2 years ago

              Nope nope sorry sorry! I just woke up and misread your comment as disagreeing with the sentiment, but I just reread it and realize that you were in agreement. I was just trying to explain my view further.

              Sorry!! Lol I’ll try to post less when I’m still tired!!

      • Spzi@lemmy.clickEnglish
        2·
        2 years ago

        people in recovery from addiction and alcohol saying how they keep seeing ads for beer or gambling

        Not that this is how it works, but I imagine a diligent algorithm looking at those individuals and that content, and then thinking “mhhmm this will generate maximum revenue!!”.

      • amki@feddit.deEnglish
        1·
        2 years ago

        From an advertiser perspective it makes sense to sell to addicted people. Mission accomplished?

    • Dan_Rachevaski@beehaw.orgEnglish
      12·
      2 years ago

      you don’t mention the copious, copious amounts of ads and sponsored contents

      wow thanks reddit, you are more and more Facebook-like now, congratulations.

      • 🐝🇭🇪🅻🅻🇪🇧🅴🆁🇹🐝@beehaw.orgEnglish
        6·
        2 years ago

        Yeah, that’s pretty bad too but I was at least willing to accept there is a valid reason for that to keep the lights on.

        However, when they go as far to break the core functionality of the website and turn it into another Facebook with psychological manipulation at its core then that’s a whole other thing entirely.

        • Dan_Rachevaski@beehaw.orgEnglish
          6·
          2 years ago

          Agreed. Honestly, if I want a FB-like Reddit, fuck that, I’ll going to Facebook.

          Enshittification sucks I would say.

    • elonspez@lemmy.worldEnglish
      1·
      2 years ago

      I hate the reddit app but I don’t have that problem. My home page is all what I’ve joined.

  • koze@feddit.deEnglish
    39·
    2 years ago

    It’s funny to read this article about the death of Digg again:

    In reality, Digg changed their business model and pretended that they didn’t. That is something that is unacceptable with communities and won’t be forgotten. Reddit co-founder Alexis Ohanian hit the nail on the head in an open letter to (now former) Digg CEO – Kevin Rose:

    “You chose to grow with venture capital and you’ve no doubt (I hope) taken some money off the table in your Series C round. I say this because this new version of digg reeks of VC meddling. It’s cobbling together features from more popular sites and departing from the core of digg, which was to “give the power back to the people.”

    https://searchengineland.com/digg-v4-how-to-successfully-kill-a-community-50450>

  • tezoatlipoca@lemmy.caEnglish
    27·
    2 years ago

    You’re missing the precursors:

    Email -> Newsgroups -> CGI forums / IRC -> Slashdot… :)

    The new Fediverse really is kicking up IRC and newsgroup vibes for this old timer. Its very exciting.

  • cap_net_admin@beehaw.orgEnglish
    22·
    2 years ago

    If you still have a Reddit account, unsub all the subreddits that are refusing to participate in a strike.

  • Cobe98@lemmy.worldEnglish
    15·
    2 years ago

    Same fucking journey as you. Reddit was a good run for 10 years, let’s see if Lemmy can work.

    • pretzel@beehaw.orgEnglish
      7·
      2 years ago

      Yeah, I almost did it, skipped digg. Seemed like a poor reddit clone at the time. Was nice to be on the right side, but sad to see it fall away. All for RSS, open source and federation though, so its nice. Reddit could have done the same - when they open sourced and allowed voat to be, they could have had a federated framework then - and allowed individual servers to handle their own APIs. They could have charged a license fee or something to commerical users who put ads on and made profits, but open source wins again I guess!

      • Cobe98@lemmy.worldEnglish
        5·
        2 years ago

        I don’t think so. Although many will remain with Reddit, there is no incentive or loyalty for a significant % to do so. If reddit is shit, why not just use FB, Twitter or regular message boards? Already I saw many subreddits have discords already.

        The question for most of those users is there a lesser evil in choosing one bad company over another? Unfortunately I just see this community content becoming fragmented as a result and no winners emerging.

        I like Lemmy / kbin but I am concerned that a dev could just shutdown their server and a community, accounts are gone. Who pays the server bills, and maintenance backups etc? This seems incredibly problematic.

        Beyond that they need a strong mobile app and 3P devs, a tool to read a users reddit profile and subscribe to similar channels, one click registration without selecting a server. It would be good to also have a mechanism for showing cross-platform posted content in a single view.

        If honestly feels like the 90s wild west Internet days again. No alternative I have seen so far can address these concerns.

      • CarbonIceDragon@pawb.socialEnglish
        3·
        2 years ago

        I mean, since there’s no central site to shut down, Lemmy failing would pretty much just mean that it stagnates and some of the bigger instances shut down, at which point there still would be some remnant of it left to stay on, if a smaller one. Failing that, it isn’t the only reddit alternative that people have been working on, so maybe one of the others will be more successful.

      • knotthatone@lemmy.oneEnglish
        2·
        2 years ago

        Nah. If Lemmy/Fediverse doesn’t work out, there will be others. This has all happened before…

        • amki@feddit.deEnglish
          2·
          2 years ago

          If the fediverse idea doesn’t work out and it’s yet another company the cycle is bound to continue.

          A big chance is in front of us to break the cycle!

          • knotthatone@lemmy.oneEnglish
            3·
            2 years ago

            Oh, I agree wholeheartedly. Decentralization is the way to go and I hope Lemmy succeeds. This particular implementation may or may not work out long term, but the underlying idea is sound.

            We’ll get it. Might take a couple tries, but we’ll get it.

  • h14h@lemmy.worldEnglish
    14·
    2 years ago

    Digg -> Reddit -> Lemmy

    After experiencing the death of two “power to the people” platforms due to profit-driven VC-backed corporate meddling, here’s hoping the third platform is the charm Lemmy & the fediverse.

    • argv_minus_one@beehaw.orgEnglish
      5·
      2 years ago

      I don’t think the Fediverse will suffer the same demise as Digg and Reddit, precisely because it’s not owned by a profit-driven VC-backed corporation, but there are a couple of other serious threats to its longevity:

      • Moderation. If the Fediverse isn’t adequately moderated, it will quickly be overrun by Nazis, pedos, and spam. That’s what killed Voat and Usenet.
      • Funding. This isn’t like IRC, where a modern server can support tens of thousands of users in its sleep. Running a system along the lines of Reddit or Twitter requires a lot of computing power, and that’s expensive. Where’s the money going to come from?
      • Da_Boom@iusearchlinux.fyiEnglish
        1·
        2 years ago

        I think smaller instances of a maximum of 1-2000 people are the way to go for the future. Most instance owners are hosting it because they want to and they have a lil extra cash to throw at it, the 500-2000 people instances are usually funded by the likes of a patreon ko.fi or other donation setup.

        These instances aren’t big enough that the cost is of an instance isn’t massive and can therefore avoid the likes of Venture capital and Angel investors, and if they start to reach the level where funding is getting a bit short even with donations, they can close new account creation untill the number of donators increases beyond a point

        TL;DR: Essentially instances should be welcoming new accounts in waves. So that their growth doesn’t outpace donation income.

    • _haha_oh_wow_@sh.itjust.worksEnglish
      2·
      2 years ago

      I was on reddit before digg, but left reddit for digg until diggv4, then I went back to reddit lol. The decentralized nature of Lemmy and the fediverse seems like it will be more resistant to that sort of bullshit though.

      • HQC@beehaw.orgEnglish
        1·
        2 years ago

        At the expense, or maybe also benefit, of slower growth and some level of unavoidable fragmentation.

    • amki@feddit.deEnglish
      11·
      2 years ago

      I kinda grew out of it. It was funny when I was an edgy teenager but it got progressively more cringeworthy as time progressed for me, even though the content may not have changed much.

      • darkmugglet@lemm.eeEnglish
        7·
        2 years ago

        I stopped engaging with Reddit when meme-ification happened.Wheb it became all about the lolz abd short pithy responses, I started using it to find more interesting articles. Gone are the days wheb the average Redditor would read and make thoughtful contributions.

        • amki@feddit.deEnglish
          7·
          2 years ago

          That is in part because the reddit algorithm doesn’t like thoughtful contributions. These take time and understanding of the discussed matter. When your metric is positive (upvote) interaction per timeframe you need easily digestable content that people immediately react to. If I have to carefully read and think about the content my vote/comment is far too late to be “hot” on reddit.

          • Cake@beehaw.orgEnglish
            3·
            2 years ago

            Yeah that’s basically it. Bots had overtaken Reddit too and just propagated that problem by re-posting posts/top comments.

        • _haha_oh_wow_@sh.itjust.worksEnglish
          6·
          2 years ago

          That depended on the subs you were in IMO, there was a lot of that but there were others that still had worthwhile stuff that wasn’t just silly shitposting for fun. Now we’ve got Lemmy though and multiple instances of it!

    • Confuzzeled@lemmy.worldEnglish
      2·
      2 years ago

      I used 4chan when I was younger but trying to go back after reddit was super depressing, I lasted about 5 minutes.

      • totallynotsocsa@beehaw.orgEnglish
        5·
        2 years ago

        I stopped using 4chan when the probably of getting goddamn CP snuff videos in the browser cache because of a /b/ raid got beyond trivial, so like pretty fucking early on.

      • toadmode@beehaw.orgEnglish
        4·
        2 years ago

        4chan definitely got worse. like it was always edgy and stupid, but after 2015 every board just kind of became /pol/

        • _haha_oh_wow_@sh.itjust.worksEnglish
          5·
          2 years ago

          Yeah, nazis kinda ruined it. pre-2010 it was more whimsical and ridiculous as opposed to cringey and unironically bigoted.

  • l0st-scr1b3@beehaw.orgEnglish
    12·
    2 years ago

    Gonna be honest it’s kinda weird to me as someone who did just move over that there’s a bunch of posts from people who just found the Fediverse claiming it as home while there’s people who have been here since it’s creation. It’s got the implication that this was created as some sort of next jump from Reddit which doesn’t really seem to be the case from my perspective.

    • hadrian@beehaw.orgEnglish
      12·
      2 years ago

      I see what you mean to an extent, and I also just moved over, but it’s worth remembering that Digg -> Reddit was the same afaik. Like Reddit had been around and established for a decent amount of time before the fall of Digg. (This is second-hand info because I wasn’t around at the time)

      • DarkwingDuck@sh.itjust.worksEnglish
        5·
        2 years ago

        I’ve been on reddit for a couple years before the flood from Digg. The quality of content and especially comments went down right then, and never recovered.

        Personally I skipped Digg entirely.

        • HQC@beehaw.orgEnglish
          2·
          2 years ago

          Depends entirely on the subreddit, in my experience. Places like AskHistorians didn’t even exist when the great Digg exodus occurred. My favorite sub was /r/cfb which also benefited greatly from the mainstream popularity.

          Not coincidental that both of these are relatively strongly moderated compared to many of the biggest/default subs.

    • vinniep@beehaw.orgEnglish
      8·
      2 years ago

      That feeling makes sense, but I think everyone knows that the Fediverse wasn’t created specifically to give them a landing in this event, just like Reddit wasn’t created to catch the Digg refugees, etc. More of a “next phase in the evolution of this concept”, and while it took a catastrophe, they’re ready to consider that it’s time to move on now.

      The trick is going to be walking that line between preserving what made the Fediverse great and not alienating the newcomers. I think there’s room for everyone, though, and really the big advantage of the Fediverse - we don’t have to agree to co-exist, and can even co-existing completely separately if needed.

      • l0st-scr1b3@beehaw.orgEnglish
        6·
        2 years ago

        I think you bring up a pretty important point about federation in that it allows for and even encourages expansion in some ways, so that’s a good way to keep optimistic about it. I guess I just feel a little embarrassed. Especially when you look at posts like the recent one asking Lemmy users how they feel about the reddit refugees, and it’s flooded with responses from Reddit refugees instead offering unsolicited feedback about design choices. Then you have threads like this with people laying claim to the fediverse more or less. It just feels like some kind of a Christopher Columbus situation. While I realize that might be a little tone-deaf it’s the best analogy I have for it.

        • vinniep@beehaw.orgEnglish
          4·
          2 years ago

          kind of a Christopher Columbus situation. While I realize that might be a little tone-deaf it’s the best analogy I have for it.

          I definitely get the sentiment. Everyone is looking for how to make this what they “need” (want) without enough consideration for what it already is and who got it there. It’s going to be a journey, that’s for sure.

        • Kalkaline @lemmy.oneEnglish
          4·
          2 years ago

          Any community is a sum of it’s members, good bad, or otherwise. I think there will be a wave of us Reddit refugees, but also word is going to spread to other places like Meta and hopefully bring in even more people. Getting people sorted into servers that are going to be able to handle the load, or even better getting them to host their own servers is going to be the way to go. Sorry if we’re stumbling all over your garden in the meantime.

          • vinniep@beehaw.orgEnglish
            2·
            2 years ago

            Getting people sorted into servers that are going to be able to handle the load, or even better getting them to host their own servers is going to be the way to go.

            That part still worries me a smidge, and it’s somewhat related to my other concern about funding/scaling. As more of the general public discover and move over, the % of the general population willing and able to host their own instance is going to steadily decrease. Not saying that we’re all gonna die or anything, but it’s going to be a shift and we’ll have to continue to adapt.

              • vinniep@beehaw.orgEnglish
                1·
                2 years ago

                I expect that in time, that’s exactly what will happen. Some instance somewhere will offer guaranteed availability and performance for a monthly fee to it’s members. That feels icky at first blush, but why should it? It’s not everyone’s cup of tea, but no one is forced to use that instance to be part of the larger community, and one instance can’t hold the community hostage like a single company social media company could. They’ll have success right up until they don’t and the Fediverse will sort it out through migrations of users and communities.

  • MobBarley@beehaw.orgEnglish
    10·
    2 years ago

    Renegade BBSes -> IRC -> slashdot -> digg -> reddit -> imgur -> discord -> mastadon
    with plenty of side quests along the way

    • oyenyaaow@lemmy.zipEnglish
      5·
      2 years ago

      Pre search engine time on Geocities trading mutual linking on each other websites, reams and reams of messages and emails

      • Da_Boom@iusearchlinux.fyiEnglish
        1·
        2 years ago

        It’s hard to tell… it doesn’t feel like one, but it remains to be seen.

        But I feel like the other alternatives to Reddit and the fediverse are more of a sidequest at this point.

  • Ecksell@lemmy.oneEnglish
    10·
    2 years ago

    Such is life, nothing lasts forever. I could think of a good song for this, but nothing comes to mind yet as Im enjoying watching that Twitch counter of closed subreddits counting up nonstop.

  • Troy@lemmy.caEnglish
    10·
    2 years ago

    I skipped Fark, but my progression is largely the same. Once in a blue moon, I still visit Slashdot. It’s like checking up on an ex to see how they’re doing.

  • ZeroCarbon@lemmy.worldEnglish
    9·
    2 years ago

    My only problem is that we are in 2023 and we still need to read a bunch of text. Why can’t we have holograms and a sexy AI whispering us the comments?