After months of getting close, the relationship between Trump and his so-called ‘first buddy’ has become ‘fraught,’ according to a New York Times reporter
I believe you that someone will think that way about the joke in the thread here on Lemmy, but imo that requires an assumption that I wish people wouldn’t make. Unfortunately I am unable to follow that screenshot you posted. If it contains a joke I am not seeing it.
You asked women or trans people to say otherwise if they disagreed with you- I’m a woman, my friends are trans people, and there are two more trans people as well. Like I said, I can’t poll everyone, but neither can you. You can choose to do with that information what you like, but there’s literally no way to prove this definitively.
As for the screenshot, the order is middle-top-bottom reading order (which I agree is confusing) or smallest font to biggest font. The middle is an account using “Elonia” as a joke, the top is a trans woman who quotes it calling it out for transmisogyny, and the bottom is a trans man replying in agreement with the trans woman.
fwiw I’m a trans woman and I think that it’s still bigotry even if the target is a shitty person. Come up with a more creative insult, it’s not hard to mock shitty people for being shitty without being misogynistic or transphobic.
Thanks for clearing up the post order. I get it now.
I think this is an overreaction to call this person a piece of shit for the joke. It probably took 5 seconds to think of and type. Which tbh so did that reply, which reads more hatefully to me than the joke.
I didn’t mean to imply that if you cannot prove it definitively, you’re “wrong”. These are all opinions. I expanded more on mine in a novel I just wrote in another reply to you (sorry for that length btw)
I appreciate the civil tone here regardless. I know that in the past I’ve seen a lot of conversations like this devolve quickly and I was kinda nervous that could happen 😬
I’m not here to judge the response of the trans people in that post, that’s their business as far as I’m concerned, just posting that it exists. (I happened to be aware of these folks talking about it so I figured it was easy to cite, I’m sure there are plenty of varied responses that are more diplomatic online)
I appreciate the tone as well, but I think it’s something that’s easier when you’re more removed from the issue. As a cis woman, I have the luxury of not being as directly affected by this joke. You can see from my example that trans people talking to other trans people may be much more hurt and angry. If they were trying to explain this in a thread like this, would it be as easy to hold a civil tone? Would someone in your position have the same patience with someone expressing their pain more bluntly as you have with me? Just some things to think about.
I mean, if someone told me I was a piece of shit for defending that joke in the way I did here, I would probably think they are emotional and irrational and maybe a piece of shit themselves. The conversation would be over at that moment and that’s to be expected. If they were respectful about it, it should go well. I buy that systemically downtrodden people should get more leeway in the way they express their anger, but that doesn’t work in a one on one setting. Tell me I’m a piece of shit baselessly, you’ve shut down the conversation and transferred your emotions to me. Now my guard is up and I want nothing to do with you. This happened to me more than a couple of times and my patience with it is quite low because I have zero reason to convince a dickhead that I’m not one
I believe you that someone will think that way about the joke in the thread here on Lemmy, but imo that requires an assumption that I wish people wouldn’t make. Unfortunately I am unable to follow that screenshot you posted. If it contains a joke I am not seeing it.
You asked women or trans people to say otherwise if they disagreed with you- I’m a woman, my friends are trans people, and there are two more trans people as well. Like I said, I can’t poll everyone, but neither can you. You can choose to do with that information what you like, but there’s literally no way to prove this definitively.
As for the screenshot, the order is middle-top-bottom reading order (which I agree is confusing) or smallest font to biggest font. The middle is an account using “Elonia” as a joke, the top is a trans woman who quotes it calling it out for transmisogyny, and the bottom is a trans man replying in agreement with the trans woman.
fwiw I’m a trans woman and I think that it’s still bigotry even if the target is a shitty person. Come up with a more creative insult, it’s not hard to mock shitty people for being shitty without being misogynistic or transphobic.
Thanks for clearing up the post order. I get it now.
I think this is an overreaction to call this person a piece of shit for the joke. It probably took 5 seconds to think of and type. Which tbh so did that reply, which reads more hatefully to me than the joke.
I didn’t mean to imply that if you cannot prove it definitively, you’re “wrong”. These are all opinions. I expanded more on mine in a novel I just wrote in another reply to you (sorry for that length btw)
I appreciate the civil tone here regardless. I know that in the past I’ve seen a lot of conversations like this devolve quickly and I was kinda nervous that could happen 😬
I’m not here to judge the response of the trans people in that post, that’s their business as far as I’m concerned, just posting that it exists. (I happened to be aware of these folks talking about it so I figured it was easy to cite, I’m sure there are plenty of varied responses that are more diplomatic online)
I appreciate the tone as well, but I think it’s something that’s easier when you’re more removed from the issue. As a cis woman, I have the luxury of not being as directly affected by this joke. You can see from my example that trans people talking to other trans people may be much more hurt and angry. If they were trying to explain this in a thread like this, would it be as easy to hold a civil tone? Would someone in your position have the same patience with someone expressing their pain more bluntly as you have with me? Just some things to think about.
I mean, if someone told me I was a piece of shit for defending that joke in the way I did here, I would probably think they are emotional and irrational and maybe a piece of shit themselves. The conversation would be over at that moment and that’s to be expected. If they were respectful about it, it should go well. I buy that systemically downtrodden people should get more leeway in the way they express their anger, but that doesn’t work in a one on one setting. Tell me I’m a piece of shit baselessly, you’ve shut down the conversation and transferred your emotions to me. Now my guard is up and I want nothing to do with you. This happened to me more than a couple of times and my patience with it is quite low because I have zero reason to convince a dickhead that I’m not one